WIKILeaks thread

[oyster shucker]

I am in complete agreement with Hangman and Tboy on this one! Although I am not a fan of Government. there is a need for classified info being kept classified or it can weaken a nation.

I'm in agreement here as well.

Wikilleaks is a cancer that needs to be stopped.

Intergovernmental operations need to stay out of public scrutiny.

Democracy like capitalism is beneficial to mankind but with limits.

 

[dreamblade]

So gentlemen,

When presented with issues of democratic governments abusing democracy for their own gain, you would prefer the onus of honesty be on the body that is perpetrating the transgression?

Wikileaks has won awards in the past for exposing some serious transgressions in Kenya.

Current example: G20 police abuse. The SIU concluded there was abuse of power, but due to the fact that most officers involved removed they nametags, there is nothing that can be done. Chief Blair insists that it's regrettable, but nothing can be done, even in the face of the press and public handing in pictures and documentation identifying the bad cops.

The need for secrecy in governmental activity is necessary, that. But so is whistleblower activity. Without the risk of an unregulated check, the government can still do pretty much what it wants.

Power corrupts. It is proven time and again. Here's a great article that includes scientific research to back it up.

So who watches the watchers?

 

[blissful]

There is No such thing as "Freedom" of anything.

 

[Nova5]

WikiLeaks’ founder Julian Assange says he's preparing for indictment for espionage in U.S. - Sky News https://bit.ly/fWveUg

 

[oagre]

An interesting point that no one has yet raised is whether Assange is extradite-able from the UK to the USA for espionage.

There is no question that a suspect can be extradited for ordinary criminal offences - i.e theft, rape, murder, fraud, assault, destroying property, etc.

However, most nations will not extradite for "political offences" - i.e offences which do not involve fundamental criminal law infringements as set out above and which are aimed at frustrating the government of the requesting country. For example, most nations will not extradite tax evaders.

The notion of "political offence" is codified for example in s. 46 of the Canadian Extradition Act. (see below).

I cannot conceive of a more blatantly "political offence" than espionage. If the UK intends to extradite Assange for this offence, I am sure that many European countries - i.e. France would most certainly refuse. It's really just a question of whether Assange can get there.

Ironically, Sweden would likely refuse to extradite Assange to the US for espionage.

 

[Nova5]

Oagre, you raise a number of astute points here. Of particular note is the following: “whether Assange is extradite-able from the UK to the USA for espionage.”

 

[Nova5]

Ron Paul Defends WikiLeaks On House Floor ...

 

[GenevieveLajoie]

What she said: The Media Gets It Wrong on WikiLeaks: It's About Broken Trust, Not Broken Condoms.

 

[Hangman]

My perspective on the whole issue is likely significantly different than the average HUBGFEite.

Ultimately, my opinion on the subject boils down to "Two wrongs don't make a right." I will not deny that the US government has done some Bad Things. However, I can't necessarily agree that leaking classified documents into the open is an appropriate remedy. As I indicated above, I think that more harm than good will come of this as governments (US for now, but who knows what government will have Gb of data stolen next) ratchet up the security measures and mount aggressive witch-hunts.

This will not help the DATD repeal crowd for example. Given that Pfc Manning, accused of passing documents to Wikileaks, is openly gay, his decision to illegally release classified data will only serve as ammunition to conservative elements in the US military who see homosexuals as unreliable and untrustworthy.

 

[Nova5]

What she said: The Media Gets It Wrong on WikiLeaks: It's About Broken Trust, Not Broken Condoms.

Just finished reading the article regarding WikiLeaks’. The part that really resonated with me was the following:
“The WikiLeaks cables present quite a different picture. What emerges is one reality (the real one) colliding with another (the official one). We see smart, good-faith diplomats and foreign service personnel trying to make the truth on the ground match up to the one the administration has proclaimed to the public. The cables show the widening disconnect. It's like a foreign policy Ponzi scheme -- this one fueled not by the public's money, but the public's acquiescence.” This quote drives home the point of reality conflicting with the official government position. It would appear that the official government position trumps the truth.

 

[oagre]

Geez, guys, when you're as old as me, you get to talk about the "good old days" and how "history repeats itself". I remember the "Pentagon Papers" and Daniel Ellsberg in the early 70's and how they leaked all sorts of embarrassing shit about the Viet Nam War. And it was stuff that richly NEEDED to be leaked.

Initially, I was appalled that the Wikileaks had occurred. But a few days later, I am starting to enjoy them. I am learning all sorts of sleazy new stuff about the US government -i.e. what it's been doing in ex Soviet Central Asia. And they really haven't leaked anything that would put any persons in harm's way - for all the US government BS and scare-mongering that's been inflicted on us.

This kind of stuff happens once every 40 years and fuck knows, the US government deserves to be caught with its pants down and publicly pissed on once in a while. Might make those motherfuckers think twice before killing the next lot of unfortunate Third World peasants they decide to bomb.

Frankly, I'm starting to like Mr Assange and beginning to hope he gets away with it and does it a little more. :666:

 

[Nova5]

Julian Assange Interrupts SNL To Explain Why He Should Be Time’s Person of The Year (VIDEO) https://mediaite.com/a/zffdu