Would you send a beautiful blonde reporter to a dangerous Country?

[Maurice Boscorelli]

"That's the beauty of a free society."^

This is always the problem when the desire for a free society/freedom of speech conflicts with political correctness. I just had ths debate over breakfast with my brother at our local greasy spoon.
He has a point as do you Maurice. No one is saying that dressing provocatively is the sole cause of sexual assaults, but if one is trying to reduce the chance of such a thing happeneing then it simply makes sense not to act in certain ways.

For example, dressing to attract attention will attract all kinds of attention desired or not, getting fall down drunk or stoned in a university party setting IS risky behaviour.

Perhaps there is or will be a utopia where man has overcome his base instincts and mental illness, confused religious beliefs and neandrethal social norms have been extinguished. In this world men and women will be equal, skin colour of no consequence, wealth and poverty abolished, religious differences overcome. Until such time, this is the world we live in, flawed as it is and to act surprised when bad things happen to people who place themselves in risky situations
is as I said before naive, or simply means one has been blinded by a desire see the world as an ideal rather than the way it is.

The officer in the letter made the mistake of using a politically loaded word in an obviously liberal setting. I dont agree with his choice of words as it meant that the message he was trying to convey became lost in his choice of words. The message itself on one of many ways to reduce risk was valid. Call me a cave man if you choose, but if a woman walks down the beach in a skimpy bikini she is fully concious that her choices will attract attention, if someone oversteps social boundaries and harasses her they are in the wrong but she must accept some degree of responcibility for her own actions.

sorry rant rant rant

Well said the only thing I would argue is that wearing a skimpy bikini on a beach isn't really inappropriate in that setting.

A story if I may. many moons ago I picked up a young lass from her place to take her to a movie in the summertime. I got busy and didn't notice her to well until I got to the car. I got in and just started driving and once again was concentrating driving and turned every now and then to talk and looked at her face. Not once did I look at what she was wearing. When arrived at the theatre for the matinee and she got out of the car I was stunned to see she wearing a tight tube top with the shortest shorts going right up her ass and three inch heals to boot. A car drove by and all the male occupants started hollering at her. I just told her to her back in the car that we were going back to her place and she was going to change. She thought I was kidding but I wasn't. My guess is her job at Filmores had desensitized her to the realities of the world we live in.

 

[KathrynBardot]

I'm just going to put this here, and then bow out of this thread. If you cannot see how equating a woman with a can of dog food is contributing to rape culture (because dog food = not human), and how blaming the woman because she "brought it upon herself" is wrong, then I have nothing further to say here.
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/shannon-galpin/whats-blonde-got-to-do-wi_b_824319.html

 

[Boing]

I'm just going to put this here, and then bow out of this thread. If you cannot see how equating a woman with a can of dog food is contributing to rape culture (because dog food = not human), and how blaming the woman because she "brought it upon herself" is wrong, then I have nothing further to say here.
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/shannon-galpin/whats-blonde-got-to-do-wi_b_824319.html

Sorry boys but I am with Kathryn on this one. Read what Ben said.

Recently, Ben Affleck said, "As long as violence against women, sexually or otherwise, remains exclusively a women's issue, it will always be an issue. We men must own this and we must recognize it as vital to our own survival. And we must help our brothers see it as such."

 

[scotty]

Well said the only thing I would argue is that wearing a skimpy bikini on a beach isn't really inappropriate in that setting.MB

Im sorry I didnt mean to imply that wearing a skimpy suit was wrong. My point was that the individual would be well within her rights to do so. If someone oversteps social boundaries and violates her rights,he is the one at fault. Im sorry it was a poor analogy. I only meant to say that people must accept some responcibility for their actions and choices not simply curse centuries of oppression and cultural acceptance of same when they are fully aware that these feelings exist.

I'm just going to put this here, and then bow out of this thread. If you cannot see how equating a woman with a can of dog food is contributing to rape culture (because dog food = not human), and how blaming the woman because she "brought it upon herself" is wrong, then I have nothing further to say here.
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/shannon-galpin/whats-blonde-got-to-do-wi_b_824319.html

I dont remember at any point suggesting that her attractiveness was the cause of her assault. only that becasue of the nature of the world we live in these things happen, I do not excuse the perpetrators or blame the victim. To admit these things occur in this world is not the same as supporting them. Only an admission of the realites of the world we live in and an acknowledgement of the serious flaws there in.

 

[scotty]

Sorry boys but I am with Kathryn on this one. Read what Ben said.

Recently, Ben Affleck said, "As long as violence against women, sexually or otherwise, remains exclusively a women's issue, it will always be an issue. We men must own this and we must recognize it as vital to our own survival. And we must help our brothers see it as such."

he went on to say it is a "weapon of power and control".
This is absolutely true. It is often a weapon of dehumanization intimidation and control, both of the victim and every other woman who hears about the victim.

I resent even the slightest implication that I would support it in any form.

 

[Maurice Boscorelli]

Sorry boys but I am with Kathryn on this one. Read what Ben said.

Recently, Ben Affleck said, "As long as violence against women, sexually or otherwise, remains exclusively a women's issue, it will always be an issue. We men must own this and we must recognize it as vital to our own survival. And we must help our brothers see it as such."

Since you agree with her maybe you can explain how equating a woman with a can of dog food is contributing to rape culture ?

The post that inspired the assertion...

 

[canuckhooker]

Since you agree with her maybe you can explain how equating a woman with a can of dog food is contributing to rape culture ?

The post that inspired the assertion...

Simple, firstly you are comparing her to an inanimate and unappealing item, so you don't have to respect her as a human being. It is much easier to assault someone if you don't see them as human, or deserving of respect.

On the other hand, you have your right to your opinion on her attractiveness, and you should be allowed to critique service, individuals etc. But that critique should be fair, balanced and respectful. Childish, frat boy cracks really don't do much for your own credibility as a commenter.

 

[canuckhooker]

Simple, firstly you are comparing her to an inanimate and unappealing item, so you don't have to respect her as a human being. It is much easier to assault someone if you don't see them as human, or deserving of respect.

On the other hand, you have your right to your opinion on her attractiveness, and you should be allowed to critique service, individuals etc. But that critique should be fair, balanced and respectful. Childish, frat boy cracks really don't do much for your own credibility as a commenter.

Having re-read my post I want to specify that my use of "you" was not aimed at Bosco, it was a generic reference to anyone.

 

[Maurice Boscorelli]

Simple, firstly you are comparing her to an inanimate and unappealing item, so you don't have to respect her as a human being. It is much easier to assault someone if you don't see them as human, or deserving of respect.

On the other hand, you have your right to your opinion on her attractiveness, and you should be allowed to critique service, individuals etc. But that critique should be fair, balanced and respectful. Childish, frat boy cracks really don't do much for your own credibility as a commenter.

Uh........The poster, not me, was insinuating that she was not attractive on a internet review board. I highly doubt the poster had any thoughts of assaulting her and making it easier to do so. That's quite a stretch even for this board.

 

[Maurice Boscorelli]

Having re-read my post I want to specify that my use of "you" was not aimed at Bosco, it was a generic reference to anyone.

Yeah the direct insults are not really my style although I did call CG a Lance Armstrong Nuthugger in another thread,lol.

Alas he knows I respect his faith in the man though, it comes from a good place.

 

[Boing]

Since you agree with her maybe you can explain how equating a woman with a can of dog food is contributing to rape culture ?

The post that inspired the assertion...

I agreed with him but I never said I wasn't shallow :frown:.

 

[tboy]

Oh yes, we certainly enjoy an enlightened society, where members of the US government are trying to take away reproductive rights, and where Toronto police tell university students "don't dress like a slut" in order to avoid rape. ()
Even you, tboy, contribute to this bullshit by comparing a woman you don't find attractive to a can of dog meat.

Yes, it's not as bad here, but neither is it perfect. And the question raised was "if you are the boss would you not think twice knowing full well the odds are against her?" - well, if we start telling women they can't do that job because they might be sexually assaulted, then what else are we going to tell them they cannot do? They can't be ambassadors to these countries, or they can't serve in humanitarian efforts like Doctors Without Borders, or hell, they can't be police officers or social workers here, because we all know those prison folk like to assault women? Well hell, let's just keep the womenfolk at home because they certainly wouldn't be assaulted in the safety of their own home, right?
If you believe that no sympathy should be afforded to people who thrill seek and then are injured, or to those who choose jobs that put them at risk, then what do you think of the sex worker who is sexually assaulted on the job? Or of the policeman who is shot in the line of duty? Or of the health worker who contracts a virus from a needle stick? Are they less-deserving of our sympathy because "they knew the risks"?

Ummm where did I say they "couldn't go"? I simply said that they know or should be told the risks before they go and if they still choose to do so, as the saying goes, they do so at their own risk. If they DO choose to ignore the warning signs? Who am I to sympathize with them....as the saying goes: you plays your cards and you takes your chances.....

Ok, on to the dress code statement. Unfortunately there are those in our society that cannot control themselves. Luckily these are few and far between. BUT, does a lion tamer smear his body in fresh blood before stepping into the cage? Does a scuba diver smear chum all over his body before swimming with sharks? No. You take steps to prevent undo risks and if wearing a fashionable coat over your micro mini helps prevent unwanted attention, where's the harm?

I mean hell's bells, even I took precautions when walking around downtown ie: staying out of dark alleys, when walking through a vacant parking lot late at night walking in the middle of the row in case there was someone lying in wait, etc. Nothing wrong with taking precautions.....and until there is an invention created that can shine a spotlight on those who might be prone to sexual assault? Having a woman dress more modestly to not put herself at risk is not a bad idea.

There was that woman last year in Toronto who came home at 2 or 3 am, pissed drunk, and decided to take the stairs up to her apartment. WHAT THE FUCK was she a) doing piss drunk and going home alone and b) taking the freaking stairs at 3 am A L O N E? Fuck, I wouldn't do that.......

Now as for the comparing a woman to a can of dog meat...umm wth are you talking about? Show me where I compared a woman to a can of anything?

As for your examples of people in professions that contain risk....the difference between them and thrill seekers is that THAT IS THEIR JOB!!!! All those examples are people who know the risks, and take them to serve the public good! In the case of female officers I believe they are never alone, they always have a partner. They also (all those professions) take P R E C A U T I O N S to prevent or minimize the dangers to their person. (ie: a female cop carries a glock and wears kevlar).

As for the assault on this reporter, as I said: knowing full well the dangers a woman faces in these countries, they should have taken P R E C A U T I O N S to insure her safety (ie: a team of body guards) just like with embedded reporters with the military, they are always protected by the soldiers around them and given kevlar, helmets, camo attire etc. They DON'T go out in purple neon spandex and dance around in front of the enemy....

Oh as for the male correspondants who have been killed "getting the story"? I don't sympathize with them either because the risk isn't necessary IMO. The worst thing the military ever did was allow news footage of a war on the 6 o'clock news.....

 

[tboy]

Since you agree with her maybe you can explain how equating a woman with a can of dog food is contributing to rape culture ?

The post that inspired the assertion...

OH ffs......I wasn't comparing her to the can of dog food, I was using the photo (as cg often does) to indicate my opinion that she was a dog/unattractive/homely....jesus....

Sorry, once again, if you can call a guy ugly, you can call a girl ugly. If you can call a guy a bastard, you can call a woman a bitch. If you can call a woman a fox, you can call her a dog......equality. E Q U A L I T Y the whole way across the board, not in some ways, not part ways, ALL the way......

Put it another way: would me posting a picture of a rose been acceptable?

 

[tboy]

Simple, firstly you are comparing her to an inanimate and unappealing item, so you don't have to respect her as a human being. It is much easier to assault someone if you don't see them as human, or deserving of respect.

On the other hand, you have your right to your opinion on her attractiveness, and you should be allowed to critique service, individuals etc. But that critique should be fair, balanced and respectful. Childish, frat boy cracks really don't do much for your own credibility as a commenter.

Oh, I bet you've never ever EVER called a woman a bitch, a guy an asshole, a guy a bastard, never? I suppose you've never called a woman hot? A fox? A doll? A hottie? Sexy? Smokin? Beautiful?

Please......if you can use positive words to show your opinion of someone's looks then the reverse also must be true. You cannot have one without the other. Ying/Yang up/down in/out......Just like you can't eat at Mcdonald's without the risk to your health. You cannot have one without the other......

and finally, I find it H I L A R I O U S that one could take offence to that, yet NOT to someone else telling the entire board about how he shoved a finger up an escorts ass during their encounter.....or how she stuck her tongue up his ass, or that she let him put his fingers inside her....talk about hypocritical........

 

[tboy]

Oh, and one comment about scotty's comment about the way a woman dresses.....

Let me give you a reminder of something I said in another post:

The problem with the way women dress is, and the advances men make because she has attracted our attention, that the problem is she is trying to attract the attention of ONE particular guy, and anyone else who responds to that is WRONG for even LOOKING. If that one particular guy made advances, or she caught him looking? SHe'd be flattered.

The problem with this attitude is if you advertise to everyone, you can't be suprised or pissed off that everyone notices.

Instead of wearing something more conservative and APPROACHING the guy she wants, she is like a fishing trawler with a gill net: they get everything NOT just the fish desired........

 

[tboy]

Oh and further to the sympathizing issue:

Here's a story: (don't I have a lot?)

I was dating this YL who had some real issues and was seeing a shrink. We were supposed to go out one friday night and she called me up an hour before I was to pick her up and she said she couldn't go. I asked why. She said (I kid you not) Billy Bob died this morning. I said "who is billy bob"?

Well, Billy bob was the son of a neighbour her sister lived next to for 6 months, 12 yrs ago.....

I said "oh, that's too bad, when did you last see him"?

Oh I never met him

Ummm.....When did your sister meet him?

Oh, she never met him either....

So when did you meet his parents?

I don't know his parents......

WTF?

I said: So you're "too upset to see me because someone you never met, related to people you don't even know, died this morning"? Do I have this right?

She paused and thought for a second......Oh, when you put it that way, it does seem rather odd...

So she went to her therapist and talked to him about it know what he said?

YOur boyfriend has a good handle on things. He doesn't let the fact that some stranger he has no connection to whatsoever affect his day to day life.....something you might want to learn from him.....otherwise? If you let every little thing bad that happens affect you so deeply it affects your life, then you're in for a LONG LONG well medicated life...(or words to that effect).

SO to summarize (and alluding to the post about caring or sympathizing) I will reserve my sympathy for those that deserve it and those that I feel deserve it......

 

[canuckhooker]

Oh, I bet you've never ever EVER called a woman a bitch, a guy an asshole, a guy a bastard, never? I suppose you've never called a woman hot? A fox? A doll? A hottie? Sexy? Smokin? Beautiful?

Please......if you can use positive words to show your opinion of someone's looks then the reverse also must be true. You cannot have one without the other. Ying/Yang up/down in/out......Just like you can't eat at Mcdonald's without the risk to your health. You cannot have one without the other......

and finally, I find it H I L A R I O U S that one could take offence to that, yet NOT to someone else telling the entire board about how he shoved a finger up an escorts ass during their encounter.....or how she stuck her tongue up his ass, or that she let him put his fingers inside her....talk about hypocritical........

You really should try and read a post before you comment on it. I never said negative comments were bad, in fact I explicitly said they were OK. Valid and accurate criticism is fine. What wasn't OK was the frat house attempts at humour that are exceedingly disrespectful or are intended to "dehumanize" the person you are talking about.

As for the hypocritical comment, I have no fucking idea what the hell you are talking about, or where that came from. If you write a review on here about an encounter between two consenting adults, I am not sure how that can compare to making degrading comments about someone. Your logic escapes me. If I was on here bragging that I jammed two fingers in the ass of an unwilling and unsuspecting SP or MA then maybe there would be merit to your argument. I know there are enough people on some of the other boards who would think that that is funny and not assault, but I am not one of them. Anything I have written about or posted about, is something that happened between two (sometimes more) consenting adults, and was written about in a respectful manner with the full knowledge of all parties involved.

 

[tboy]

Canuck: something I think you don't realize, when someone posts a quote, and writes comments afterwards, that doesn't mean EVERY word written pertains directly to the quote. Often they include references to other's posts.....so, with that in mind, maybe my post will make more sense to you?

(I do it a LOT to save space, because if I included all the quotes from all the posts I refer to my posts would be more than a page long....so relax will ya?)

(furthermore, rating a woman a 3/10 is far far FAR less degrading than bragging about how many fingers a guy shoved up her ass, IMO......)

 

[canuckhooker]

Canuck: something I think you don't realize, when someone posts a quote, and writes comments afterwards, that doesn't mean EVERY word written pertains directly to the quote. Often they include references to other's posts.....so, with that in mind, maybe my post will make more sense to you?

(I do it a LOT to save space, because if I included all the quotes from all the posts I refer to my posts would be more than a page long....so relax will ya?)

(furthermore, rating a woman a 3/10 is far far FAR less degrading than bragging about how many fingers a guy shoved up her ass, IMO......)

Point taken. And again, a rating of 3/10 is not necessarily degrading, particularly if the person puts themselves out there to be rated. Over the top comments meant to be deliberately insulting or degrading, are problematic.

 

[tboy]

Ok, I'm glad you realized I wasn't trying to insult you or anything.

But don't you agree though that if you can express your attraction to someone like saying she's a fox, or a hottie, or whatever, without it being degrading, then you should also be able to say she's a dog, or fugly, or whatever as well without being degrading?

For example: a common term I've heard over the years has been; she's so hot I bet she shits strawberry ice cream......and I've also heard (for men as well as women) she was so ugly her parents tied a steak around her neck so the dog would play with her.