What has happened to Men....

[tboy]

I've heard people say that women have it great these days. They can seize independence, success and professional achievement outside the home, but also be spoiled and pampered by their men. The best of both worlds.

But, the reality seems more like the women have to work doubly hard. They have to bust hump to succeed in the workplace, and they retain all their wifely/motherly duties.

The "evolution of men" on the other had has been much slower. Some guys expect (and get) praise just for changing a diaper.

You forgot the fact that while women strove for equality in all things, they somehow forgot that that also included taking the initiative when it comes to dating. Now I can't say for teens or 20 somethings, but over the last 15 - 20 yrs (when the topic came up) I asked just about every woman I met "would you ever ask a guy out or approach him in a bar, grocery store etc"? All but one said "hell yeah".....then I asked a follow up question: "have you"? ALL said "No".....I'm talking, maybe 75 -100 women over the years........what does that tell you? Maybe that things haven't evolved quite as fast as some allude to....

Oh yeah, sending out a private message via an internet dating site doesn't count at all......

I see your point about women still having to be mothers, but then again, fathers still had to be fathers throughout history.....

More on this point though, I read about, hear about, and have personally experienced women who want the guy with the $$$ and a good job, yet bitch and moan and complain when their husband works so hard for so long to provide for the family........I mean, how many times have you heard "wah wah wah he's always working" and "wah wah wah he's never home....".......you can't have it both ways.....

 

[RAWD]

You forgot the fact that while women strove for equality in all things, they somehow forgot that that also included taking the initiative when it comes to dating. Now I can't say for teens or 20 somethings, but over the last 15 - 20 yrs (when the topic came up) I asked just about every woman I met "would you ever ask a guy out or approach him in a bar, grocery store etc"? All but one said "hell yeah".....then I asked a follow up question: "have you"? ALL said "No".....I'm talking, maybe 75 -100 women over the years........what does that tell you? Maybe that things haven't evolved quite as fast as some allude to....

Oh yeah, sending out a private message via an internet dating site doesn't count at all......

I see your point about women still having to be mothers, but then again, fathers still had to be fathers throughout history.....

More on this point though, I read about, hear about, and have personally experienced women who want the guy with the $$$ and a good job, yet bitch and moan and complain when their husband works so hard for so long to provide for the family........I mean, how many times have you heard "wah wah wah he's always working" and "wah wah wah he's never home....".......you can't have it both ways.....

That's what I mean about women having the best of both worlds. Being independent or girly-girl is at their discretion and prerogative.

As for complaining about working....NO KIDDING! I have several friends who married women from wealthy families. They (girls) all complained about absent fathers and how they wanted a husband who would be home and be a good father. My buddies are solid middle management, earning good incomes but not rich by any means. Now their wives all complain about how little their husbands earn and how tough life is.

I guess the only thing I can say is that, like everything else in a great relationship, it's all about mutual love and respect and clear communications.

 

[ChaosTheory]

They (girls) all complained about absent fathers and how they wanted a husband who would be home and be a good father. My buddies are solid middle management, earning good incomes but not rich by any means. Now their wives all complain about how little their husbands earn and how tough life is.

I guess the only thing I can say is that, like everything else in a great relationship, it's all about mutual love and respect and clear communications.

I agree RAWD.
I try to work hard because I do not want to be an absentee husband nor father. Evolving my work efforts to limit the amount of time working but maximize financial security.
Furthermore the savings and continual income from my work directly and through investment I want to increasingly establish to provide a good life for the aforementioned when I do have a family.

It is a delicate balance. it is tough. And I feel like I am chasing utopia with many sacrifices.

What you said about mutual love, respect and clear communications (as well as trust…and loyalty…sigh), should and does trump everything.

i need to see a SP/MPA

 

[RAWD]

This is a weird convo to have on a perv board. But, I know that the perfect relationship exists. I've been in one, and I've been in...not ones. When it works, its amazing.

Youre completely right about trust and loyalty. Absolutely crucial, and once lost, never truly regained.

I think it's part fate or destiny, and part commitment. A relationship works when two people want it to work. It's about compromise that should never feel like sacrifice. Its about accepting someone for who they are but loving them enough to push them forward to reach their full potential. And when youre both on the same page, it's like alchemy. You feel absolutely safe and invincible, yet thrilled and challenged.

Now, what are the odds of finding that connection?

 

[Swagger]

Now, what are the odds of finding that connection?

You really want to know when you know deep down the odds are against it/you?

 

[RAWD]

You really want to know when you know deep down the odds are against it/you?

Players always believe they'll win. Right, Swagg?

 

[tboy]

This is a weird convo to have on a perv board. But, I know that the perfect relationship exists. I've been in one, and I've been in...not ones. When it works, its amazing.

Youre completely right about trust and loyalty. Absolutely crucial, and once lost, never truly regained.

I think it's part fate or destiny, and part commitment. A relationship works when two people want it to work. It's about compromise that should never feel like sacrifice. Its about accepting someone for who they are but loving them enough to push them forward to reach their full potential. And when youre both on the same page, it's like alchemy. You feel absolutely safe and invincible, yet thrilled and challenged.

Now, what are the odds of finding that connection?

Good points but I'd also like to add that you should never take the other for granted. What I mean is that (and I have seen lots who do this) that once you "have" that person, you stop trying to get them.......The purest definition of this is the difference between falling in love and being in love. I had a buddy who was a player and was the best at getting women....he could walk into a bar and have 10 follow him around like lost puppies.....yet when he finally got one and entered a relationship with her, things started falling apart. Kind of like he's like advertising: you can have the steak, or you can have the sizzle, he was all sizzle.

I tell you, with my two longest relationships, I wanted those women as much on the last day as the first......and did things to that end....(worst mistake I ever made was making one so secure in my feelings for her, she took them for granted and did whatever she wanted with no regard for me).

 

[Baz]

Tboy, the woman that let you down when you wore your heart on your sleeve was more than likely a taker. In this world we have taker and giver personalities. You need to find a woman who is a giver, one that enjoys seeing her mate happy. The perfect scenario of course is having to givers both caring about one another's feelings. Rawd, I think it's a great conversation to have for this forum and your last post brilliantly illustrates what a relationship is all about.

 

[SillyGirl]

Tboy, the woman that let you down when you wore your heart on your sleeve was more than likely a taker. In this world we have taker and giver personalities. You need to find a woman who is a giver, one that enjoys seeing her mate happy. The perfect scenario of course is having to givers both caring about one another's feelings. Rawd, I think it's a great conversation to have for this forum and your last post brilliantly illustrates what a relationship is all about.

I agree there are givers, and there are takers. I don't know that I agree an ideal scenario would be two givers...there is no balance in a relationship like that. Successful relationships usually happen when both people fulfill the other's needs, and how could two givers do that?

I don't think a taker is necessarily incapable of caring about a partner's feelings. I also don't think Tboy's gf getting so comfortable and secure in the relationship necessarily means she was a taker, although that is certainly a possibility. It's very common in a long-term relationship for one or both parties to stop making an effort...another reason I don't want to get married again. I don't want to be taken for granted, and I don't want to do that to anyone else.

I totally agree this is a great conversation for this forum. We're all human, we've all had relationships with all of their complications and issues, and it's never a bad thing to be able to talk about it.

 

[RAWD]

In tboys case, it obviously wasn't a relationship of mutual love and respect. Ive been in that boat too, where I loved someone unconditionally, supported her through some brutal times, hoping that when things got better, we'd hit our sweet spot and share some happy times. Well, when stability and good times arrived, and I wasn't part of the game plan. Twice. Would I do anything differently? Nope. I loved her and I followed my heart. I kept my word. I was a great friend. She decided to follow her own heart.

SillyG, I have to disagree about givers. I don't believe that people can be happy only giving. Some ppl, me included, love to give. But we all need a little getting once in a while. Most are not an endless tank.

 

[HOF]

​

 

[Baz]

Is the conversation too deep for you Hof? If it's not of a sexual conquest you cannot properly contribute to the debate?

Rawd, you're a good man. I can see that from your posts.

 

[RAWD]

I hear HOF is a good guy in real life. Just loves to stir the shit on line. Lol.


Thanks Bazerko, but I'm not a good guy....I'm just trying get better.

 

[-b]

I think we classify the genders too much, I feel we should be looking at each individual
behavior, personality, etc....We tend to just lump it on the sexes ......
The male does this or the female does that....
I have seen males hurt from divorce and females. Each individual reacts differently

When I posted the pictures it was not about marriage. What I was thinking
about was, what happened to Men being Gentlemen..In manners, carrying themselves, etc
That is why I also posted a female with it.....Because women have changed also.

Yes I am hurt with my marriage but it takes 2 people to communicate and try to make things
right...2 to cause the problems, 2 not taking blame, but we look at it as a man and woman but gay
marriages have the same issues...Just my 2 cents....

 

[RAWD]

As much as I like my women to be strong, smart and successful, I like good old fashioned manners. I like to open doors, hold bags, or stand when a lady arrives or leaves a table. I'm not sure if that's a sex thing or simply an ingrained order of the world that gives me confort. As much as it may be uncool or uncouth to say it, things seem to work better when men are men and women are women. Even in gay relationships. Now, pardon me, as I have a cocktail party this afternoon hosted by an emasculated friend and his man-wife.

 

[tboy]

I have to agree rawd, I still do that but then again, I'll hold the door for a guy too.....and yeah, I liked it better when women were women and men were men....I've spoked about a transsexual I worked with....I couldn't win with him/her. I'd tell a blond joke and their female side would get offended, I'd tell a male joke, and their male side would get offended....just couldn't win!

As for the gf in question, I don't know that she was so much a taker as much as someone who was simply just messed up. (this is the greek woman I have written about). When we first started dating, I was not her number 1 priority, but close. She'd balance the demands of her family with being with me. After a while, it was all family family family and no matter what, I took 3rd or 4th place (sometimes 10th) over everything else. It seemed that things were best with us whenever we broke up....then got back together...then broke up...then got back together......it seemed she was the most dedicated to the relationship when she thought she was losing me....

The last time we broke up she asked if we could get together a couple of weeks later, I told her I was busy, it came out that I had a date that night, she flipped out.....she told me this, she was driving home from work that night after our conversation and realized that if she didn't do something fast, she'd lose me forever, so she called me back and asked me to break the date for that weekend, and could we go away somewhere together for the weekend? Like a moron I said ok, broke the date, had a great weekend with her, and sure enuff, a month or so later it was back to the same BS.....

Lucky for me though, some mutual friends told me they saw her recently and she'd doubled in size heheheh (dodged a bullet on that one lol).......

 

[RAWD]

Ahhhhhh, the Greek woman. See TBoy, as much as a tough guy you might like to talk like you are, youre a fluffball.

As am I.

We should kill a bottle of Scotch one day and talk about the ones that got away and the ones we dodged. Lol.

 

[tboy]

I don't know about being a fluffball, maybe thinking too much with my dick lol she was H O T hot and she was the best in bed I ever had, including pros and ex-pros who wanted to fuck my brains out lol..........sure I loved her, but man, she got my motor running!!!

 

[thesun]

I tell you, with my two longest relationships, I wanted those women as much on the last day as the first......and did things to that end....(worst mistake I ever made was making one so secure in my feelings for her, she took them for granted and did whatever she wanted with no regard for me).

Tboy, I am sure many of the men have had this similar experience. It got to the point you stop being yourself which you end up feeling unattractive. I need to avoid those kind of women.

 

[Baz]

Thesun, it is important to always be yourself. A false front is temporary and within time your real personality will come to light. At this point it can put strain on the relationship.